Talk:Tahnnakai Temple (mission)
Cooperative? Does anyone know why this mission is called cooperative? As far as I saw there were no other groups in the mission, like the other cooperative mission so far, Vizunah Square. I know its called cooperative in the game, but is there any extra meaning to cooperative?--Chrono traveller 14:49, 17 May 2006 (CDT) :Umm, all "regular" missions are called "cooperative" missions. Nothing special to this one (also that name is not unique to Vizunah Square). --[[User:Eightyfour-onesevenfive|'84-175']] (talk) 04:06, 20 May 2006 (CDT) ::Yeah, I forgot to revise this. I was confused myself, since on the Canthan mission page it only listed Tahnakai Temple, Unwaking Waters, and Vizunah as Cooperative, I thought it was something special. --Chrono traveller 16:15, 20 May 2006 (CDT) where do you end up after this mission? just wondering -User:PanSola (talk to the ) 22:59, 23 May 2006 (CDT) :Zin Ku Corridor I believe. --Chrono traveller 23:16, 23 May 2006 (CDT) Grammar mistake in end cinematic "the luxon's honour their hero ..." bad anet! — Skuld 11:55, 4 June 2006 (CDT) :Sue them!! [[User:Foo|'Foo']] 12:10, 4 June 2006 (CDT) :: It's a way of spelling it in Europe. Settle down. You're coloured green with envy for their superior spelling. *shot at* :::Luxon's. It's not a way of speaking English anywhere. Settle down. --68.142.14.91 23:13, 7 June 2006 (CDT) :::It's a way of spelling everywhere, but it's an abhorrently incorrect way. For more information, read the book Eats, Shoots & Leaves. -- Dashface 06:33, 12 July 2006 (CDT) i know how to us'e apostrophe's!! — Skuld 07:56, 12 July 2006 (CDT) Luxon's could mean 1 luxon whose scitzophrenic (if thats hoow you speel it) Master reward question Does anyone know how to do this mission under 20:00 for master reward ? My record so far is 23:00 :( Am i missing something obvious ? :Know your way through the temple, take human players (not hench). You don't have to clear the last room completely, only the Afflicted guarding Vizu are required for completion AFAIR. And a Minion Master is of great help there too. --Chi Li 08:43, 9 June 2006 (CDT) ::Try getting 21:03 cause an Assassin liked to Death's Charge *rolls eyes*. Any multiple attacking skills, Spiteful Spirit, Barrage, Fireball, etc works great, especially if your tank can keep the enemy together. --Gares Redstorm 09:10, 9 June 2006 (CDT) :::I got Masters with Henchies, but they are right, humans just kill a lot faster. And at the end, just take out the Temple Guardians at one bridge and then pull the afflicted and Vizu through it.--Karlos 13:12, 9 June 2006 (CDT) ::::How the hell... I'm having some trouble henching this as they tend to run in and aggro every Guardian in sight, then stand still while the AE toasts them. Oh great Karlos, please bless me with your insight in how to avoid henchman stupidity. (This is on my warrior, my necro went through there with a PUG so I never tried that.) -- Bishop rap| ] 15:26, 13 June 2006 (CDT) ::::Well, it turns out either the henchmen or myself have had an AI upgrade since last time, because right after I wrote the above, I managed to complete the mission with henches only. However, it wasn't anywhere near master time (in fact, I missed expert by a couple of minutes), so I'd still love to know how that can be pulled off. :) -- Bishop rap| ] 16:10, 13 June 2006 (CDT) :::::Well, with henchies you just need to control the aggro very tightly. Henchies are a lot more cooperative if they don't start attacking. Once they start atacking it all becomes personal and they just need to end he life of that enemy. So, wjem pulling (either afflicted or Temple Guardians), go in yourself, and pull out and at all times KEEP MOVING. If you stop for any reason, henchies will start to think, and you don't want them to do that. So, in one smooth circle, walk in, aggro, pull out then stop when henchies are in a good spot then call out your main target. :::::A useful strategy against the Temple Guardians is to aggro them yourself, then keep moving till they use up their Breath of Fire skills. Then engage. Try to interrupt their Bed of Coals. The one nasty room is the ranger's room. Because of some reason half the room aggroes if you come near the furthest Temple Guardian. :::::If you need help doing it PM me in-game. --Karlos 02:32, 14 June 2006 (CDT) :Since the timer starts at 10 minutes and 4 additional minutes are added for each boss killed before Vizu, to get Master's Reward you have to finish before 18:00 (+ a little margin to offset the time it takes to run to Master Togo at the beginning and start the timer). Is my math correct? Since this missions offers the unique opportunity to observe how well you are doing timer-wise, I think this info should be added to the page. Quizer 03:52, 9 February 2007 (CST) ::yes, it is right because 7x3+10=38 minus the master's time 38-20=18--Fox007 15:09, 3 April 2007 (CDT) My usual good luck: Just doing this one--need this and two others for cantha protector-- and first time, a spirit gets 'stuck' behind a chest spawn...ok...try again; second time, different spirit, flipping AGAIN gets stuck behind a chest spawn...third time, and, I simply could not believe it, a third spirit gets stuck behind a chest spawn. Nothign to do but restart. ithought i got a great time but you got like 15min i only got 16 :( :I beat this mission in 17:13 with Livia (Template:OANDUsx/MUhpAQDPgGwEHVZC), Kahmu (Template:OgGjkuqI7OBYoLzNoYu92uXBAA), Ogden Stonehealer (Template:OwYT0yHDzZmUP20c6w4dNggMAA), Cynn, Sister Tai, Headmaster Vhang, and Jamei. Notes - question Definately clear out the outer circle first while in the final and 8th area. Rushing the final area would be suicide, as all the roaming patrols would just rush the center. That's complete BS from what I know, the patrolling afflicted rangers won't run into the center but keep moving around (and attacking ya if they come near enough), while the temple guardians don't even move! I don't want to delete anything before getting some opinions....should that note stay or not ? --Torins 23:29, 29 June 2006 (CDT) :If you've actually tried it yourself and seen the result, feel free to edit the article. --68.142.14.71 23:43, 29 June 2006 (CDT) ::Ok, I've done it....i'm 100% sure the temple guardians don't attack when you go inside (unless you get them in your aggro circle, that is). That's how i've gotten 5x masters in Tahnnakai...if we took time to kill every single guardian and afflicted ranger there, we wouldn't have done it <20mins. --Torins 02:29, 30 June 2006 (CDT) :::The afflicted on the outer circle do rush to the center while the Temple Guardians stay right where they are. At least that's what happened to me just now, however since Master Togo got himself killed very close to the end, I'll have the chance to observe it once more... - Quizer 03:43, 9 February 2007 (CST) Teaming on this Mission I'm finding it extremely difficult to get on a human team for this mission. Even when I do, not everyone shows up and there are always leeches. Is this typical in this area and why, or am I just having bad luck? ::just bad luck i always have good party's --fox007 You could probably beat it with henchies. I beat it on my fourth try using the heroes gwen, ogden, and vekk while using a monk, two warriors, and a rit as henches Hints from Vizu WARNING: SPOILERS At the end, Vizu says in the cinematic that there will be plenty of time for her and Togo to talk after Shiro has been defeated...could she be hinting as to the end part of the storyline when Togo dies? —''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' 63.64.215.122 ( ) }. :Maybe, or she could just mean that he's unlikely to live forever. -- Dashface 07:42, 20 November 2006 (CST) :I'll have to agree with the above response. Vizu's invitation to further discussions is never meant to be a dark foreshadowing, since she's not the kind to see into the future (ie. Glint from Prophecies). — Sixshot 08:05, 20 November 2006 (CST) ::Or it could have nothing to do with death at all, and she could simply be saying she'll still be in the temple after Shiro's defeat. You don't need to be dead to talk to the ghosts in the temple, you just need to be allowed entry in the first place. Draxynnic 23:37, 4 February 2007 (CST) :just by the way she says it in the cinematic I can see it's pretty obvious that this is a hint towards the end of the storyline. "never meant to be a dark foreshadowing", "not the kind to see into the future" come on, she's a character in a storyline which was written by the game designers... Ofcourse it's part of the storyline... Duh..... Just Fair Warning Compared to all the missions leading up to this, this one is exponentially harder. I was able to hench all the previous Factions missions, but this one, even with a group of experienced friends, is insanely hard. Even with proper pulling and a well-balanced team. Have tried it a few times and haven't beaten it yet (4 humans, the rest well-built Heroes). Hopefully will beat it tonight with a full team of friends. BEWARE. * BEWARE - Well that is easier said than done since you cannot simply go on without the mission. It really sucks - I am happy that I started Guild Wars with Nightfall because that mission really takes the fun out of the game. * I found it rather easily when I did it with my E/Me. Maybe because our party worked well togeather? I just finished it with my N/Mo, and a PUG, and we beat it about 30 seconds over the expert's time. It was hard this time around, one of the reasons being lag. But, I actually found this easier than Naphui Quater. : Weird. This mission isn't more than moderately difficult with heroes/henchies, and it's only moderately difficult if you're trying to beat the clock for master's. If you're willing to take all the time in the world, you can pull small groups away from each area and whittle down the crowds into easily managed fights. Nothing patrols (except for a few lone rangers in the very last chamber), so no worries of unexpected encounters. It'll take longer to do that way, but it's a guaranteed way to get past this mission easily. I'd rate it the second or third easiest mission in Factions (after Minister Cho's Estate -- Zen Daijun more or may not be more difficult depending on what level you are when you get to it). --68.187.144.197 09:50, 27 November 2007 (UTC) ::I got hung upon this mission for a while before I beat it for the first time, but since then its no problem. Just watch your aggro and stick to the walls. If you flag henchies or heros, or tell other players to stay in certin areas instead of everyone splitting up, its easy to knock off this mission in time for masters. ----silentbp 08-21-08 Hero + Hench Solo Masters Masters at 16:25 with Sister Tai, Jamei, Chiyo and Nika as henchies. Zhed and Sousuke with identical SF builds, Olias as MM and myself as an axe warrior - nothing special, axe attacks and Watch Yourself-. There were several henchman deaths, but the enemies generally got nuked really bad by the eles while the bone horrors kept them body-blocked. Warrior of Torment 15:15, 16 May 2007 (CDT) After a few (massive) fails on this mission, trying it solo, and having put it off (and most of Factions) for ages, I got a masters in 18:14 (so, room to spare). The fails were with heal monk (me) / interrupt mes/warrior/fire ele composition, btw. This was the composition of the group - myself (a monk) and 3 heroes, and 4 henchmen: Human - Mo/E - Running Glyph of Renewal + Aegis + RoF + Protective Spirit. Had Blessed Aura on for 30% longer ench. Rest is variable. Always kept Aegis up during battle. Slapped PS and RoF on the (1) Tank, my Koss. Koss - W/any (mine was W/Mo for Rebirth) - standard sword warrior build - Riposte/Deadly/Wild Blow/Distracting Blow (handy for bosses). Elite was Charge, which did help cut down on some run time, but it isn't essential imo. A human or hero warrior tank is essential for the first few fights or when the minions take so much damage (ranger boss) that Olias is minion-less. Zhed - E/Me - standard Searing Flames build, Me for Elemental Resistance. Olias - N/E - standard Minion Master **MM is pretty much essential for Afflicted areas, since they absorb afflict-o-bombs better**. Flesh golem, Dark Bond (v important), Glyph of Lesser Energy was the only E skill. Could go /Me for Elemental Resistance too. Henchmen were: Cynn (ok nuker), Sister Tai (ok healer - without a Prot monk in this mission = mission is a fail, so I switched to Prot for it), Professor Gai (crappy use of Shelter, as in he didn't use it at all, but good healer + rez), Kai Ying (earth ele - essential for wards). Had about 2 deaths (both me, as I wasn't using flags for heroes/hench because the constricted spaces meant they often got stuck or screwed up correct flag use - and minions don't follow flags anyway). Run in, wait for everyone to form around you, run a bit, try and pull (didn't have a bow, so I ran a bit, touched a guardian/afflicted, pulled back a bit), cast GoR+Aegis, keep it up throughout the entire fight, try and get everyone into a small area and ideally inside an Elemental Ward. Call Targets well (monks/rits first, which I only followed half the time - I'd rather target a close warrior often than the monk on the other side of the room, which gets me or another softy killed). Last room just clear one bridge, leave everyone else that isn't essential for you to get to the center, kill monks, Vizu, and then everyone else (Eles). Good luck all (esp the above person). Sadly, from NF, I was used to having a mesmer with me and a curses necro; this doesn't work in most of Factions. This sort of explains the popularity all over of fire eles + minion masters - everyone's used to that working best, from Factions. Not so in NF. -Scyfer 12:57, 4 December 2006 (CST) ::Done this Mission in 17:30 as Me/A (Arcane Echo, Spiritual Pain, Assasins Promise), with a friend as Healmonk, Master as MM, Zhed with Searing, Devona, Sister Tai, Jamai, Vhang. ::It was quite an easy run.-84.156.112.42 13:50, 19 December 2006 (CST) I had no difficulty completing this mission with heroes/henches in 17:40 as a Dervish with Avatar of Melandru. Before starting a fight, I'd activate the avatar. This gave me a ridiculous amount of HP and made me immune to the afflicted rangers' Throw Dirt and, because I ran in ahead of the NPCs, I drew the vast majority of the enemies to me. With such high HP and two healers in my party (along with Mhenlo), I was able to tank each battle with little difficulty. I took along a few AoE enchantments (I used Heart of Holy Flame and Zealous Renewal), some scythe attacks (Chilling Victory), and had several elementalists along for the ride (Zhed, Cynn, Headmaster Vhang), so I was able to clear most of the rooms in less than 1:30.Drwhite 14:03, 25 January 2007 (CST) Done it in 14:57 with hench ownzzzzzzzzz — Skuld 08:38, 22 February 2007 (CST) Ward Against Harm makes it a walk in the park. Yaki 14:09, 24 February 2007 (CST) I had little trouble getting master's in this mission with my dervish - and that was even though I was very cautious and let the henchies and heroes pick up most of the slack, since I was doing survivor. I didn't get it first time, but between capping all eight elites from the mission, I got a lot of practice. By the time I captured the fifth skill, I easily got master's. That boss with Sliver Armor is pretty damn dangerous, though... Quizer 12:21, 7 March 2007 (CST) Done it with hero/hench: 1 Ele-Earth(sandstorm), 1 Ele-Fire(Searing Flames), 1 Nec-MM. The Henchmen: 2 Monks, 1 Rit and Eve for fueling. I was a Burning Arrow/Interrupt Ranger. Time: 15:54 (not a perfect run, can be improved). Expert's on first try with only Heroes and Hench, no more than two or three deaths, and made sure to completely wipe all monsters from every room...no deaths on Vizu's room either...zzzzzz, fun mission, but it's too short. Needs more rooms! (T/ ) 01:38, 18 April 2007 (CDT) Masters at 11:58 - wow - with my Dervish, 2 SF Ele's Heroes, 1 MM Hero, Hench - Mesmer, Earth, Monk and Rit. I used a Balzathar build on my Dervish and just charged into every battle head on, no pulling, was cake, I took the punishment and Nukers finished off. Ozien Cartographer note necessary? I'm wondering if the just-added cartographer note is really necessary, because the only Factions missions it wouldn't apply to are Vizunah Square and Imperial Sanctum (not accessible as explorable areas) and Nahpui Quarter (explorable area is different from mission area). In fact, in all of the remaining 10 missions, there are areas that are locked off during the mission, requiring you to re-enter them after you complete the mission. In my opinion, this is a common-sense note that doesn't need to be on individual mission pages. —Dr Ishmael 08:40, 17 July 2007 (CDT) :This explorable, however, has a significantly-sized area that is unlocked after the mission, and not everyone notices that the first time. — [[User_talk:Kyrasantae|'kyrasantae']] 09:19, 17 July 2007 (CDT) Beat Record I beat my previous record of 21 mins with a whopping 15:57 completion time, in Normal Mode. I was a Fire Nuker, had MM Hero, Air Magic Spike Nuker, Healer Hero, then Devona, Talon, Jamei, and Eve. Easy as pie. Concentrated on killing Bosses first, Ritualists second, Monks third, and then the minions took care of the rest. Sweet! --MagickElf666 16:11, 5 August 2007 (CDT) best party?? Can anyone advise a good party for this mission?? —''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' 90.199.57.161 ( ) }. :Pretty much any decent party can do this mission if you're not concerned about getting Master's. If you do want Master's, though, I did it with two Minion Master heroes. —Dr Ishmael 12:09, 16 September 2007 (CDT) lots and lots of nuking :) --Chris1645 12:12, 16 September 2007 (CDT) I'm pretty sure I made Master's with henches and heroes; probably Dunkoro and Tahlkora as a healer and a boon prot monk, respectively, and Olias as a minion master. Can't remember the henches, but Devona, and Cynn are almost guaranteed. Not sure on the other two. Gai and Panaku, maybe. --Canthros 12:19, 16 September 2007 (CDT) :Just an addendum to my previous comment: wasn't the first try, just the first successful one. Be careful pulling. --Canthros 12:22, 16 September 2007 (CDT) :Further addendum: my character is a ranger, but I do not recall what build I was using; probably a fiery barrager. --Canthros 12:25, 16 September 2007 (CDT) :Just checked; only made Expert, not Master's. Probably not the best party, then. --12:38, 16 September 2007 (CDT) ::I just did this mission with four people, three of them heroes... Yeah. Me, an MM with an out of use build, Melloni with a VoS build, and - wait for it - Dunkoro and Tahlkora running LoD. 21 minutes, could get masters EASILY i actually god disconnected in the middle and lost about three minutes of time or so. Someone else please try this, because this seems ridiculous to me... Seraphfamily 02:51, 10 November 2007 (UTC) :::Let me know on my talk page or here if you want the builds, btw. Seraphfamily 02:52, 10 November 2007 (UTC) : I did this in 16:45 with heroes and henchies. My group was a myself (R/Mo Barrager), Talkora (LoD Hybrid), Olias (MM), Zhed Shadowhoof (Searing Flames Ele, no mesmer skills), Devona, Talon Silverwing, Jamei, and Lo Sha. I pulled (or at least tried to) when I entered each room and called targets about every 10 seconds (focus on Rits and Monks). I breezed through all the rooms. I was at about 11-12 minutes when I got to Vizu.FiveAcez 18:53, 15 May 2008 (UTC) ::There is no "best" party in that generality. In easy mode, there is considerable time pressure, but anything reasonably heavy on damage should work fine provided that you have a few healers. In hard mode, it helps to avoid melee entirely, which makes it dramatically easier to do the surgical pulling necessary for the mission. I think the heroes I settled on were typically a protection monk, water elementalist, and poison/broad head arrow ranger. If you can fill one of the hero roles yourself, a domination mesmer for the other hero works nicely. You can then grab a couple healer henchmen, Su, and something else ranged. That's adequate damage for master's reward in hard mode, though I'm not sure if it would be enough for easy mode. Quizzical 19:48, 15 May 2008 (UTC) Completed in Master with Me/Rt Gwen hero and the rest being henchmen (Jamei, Tai, Chiyo, Nika, Su, and Cynn). I'm an A/W. M42 05:32, December 16, 2009 (UTC) Hard mode? Does anyone have any tips for doing this mission in hard mode?68.54.131.134Winged Immortality. Well, I finished the mission in Hard Mode. But was 23 seconds over masters time limit. Strategy that seems to help - Pulling - especially in the first room where there are several healers. Flag your H/H outside the room, pull with a longbow. I took Olias mm/bomber, Margrid interrupter, Zhed earth ele with knockdown skills, Devona, Talon and two hench healers. Going to keep trying for Masters. If anyone else has any hard mode tips, please feel free to contribute. 68.54.131.134Winged Immortality :First off, please new comments go to the bottom, that way it is easier for users to find and add to them. No one probably replied to you previously, because you put this at the very top, therefore, no one looked at it lol. :Second, my suggestion to you is to post on This person's talk page Quizzical is always doing edits to mission articles for hard mode versions, so if anyone can help you, he/she can. Aggro [[User:Isk8|'Sk8']] 17:48, 15 February 2008 (UTC) ::I've only done Prophecies in hard mode. I add hard mode sections to missions after going through a mission with all ten of my characters in hard mode, which is enough to see nearly everything that is likely to go wrong apart from flagrant stupidity. It takes quite a while to do that, so I haven't done it outside of the Prophecies campaigns yet. ::As for Tahnnakai Temple in particular, in easy mode, to get master's reward with only henchmen, I found it useful to skip fighting some mobs. My write-up on it that I did a long time ago is User:Quizzical/Factions_Easy#Tahnnakai_Temple, which may or may not be of any use to you. It's not necessarily better than what's already on the main mission page (and I completely leave out parts that I thought were easy), but does at least give another perspective. Movement patterns tend to be the same in easy mode and hard mode, with only that mobs move along the same routes faster in hard mode. —''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' Quizzical ( ) }. :::Finally accomplished Masters, HM, with the following team: Heroes: Olias mm/bomber, Vekk, SF /ms build, Zhed, earth ele with knockdown skills. Henches: Devona, Talon, and two hench healers. Time was 29 min 17 seconds. Sorry about putting the note at the top, I am new to contributing :) Tips for HM: one word - PULLING!!! Aoe spells and MM also help tremendously. I also found that it helps cut ur time to take "Charge!!" and place ur attacks so that you dont have to kill everything in one room. 68.54.131.134Winged Immortality ::::Now that I've tried it, it appears that this mission is about pulling, not builds. Kind of like in easy mode, though the parts where pulling matters are different. Afflicted elementalists hit quite hard, which can be a problem in the fifth and seventh rooms. In the seventh room in particular, when you come near, all ten afflicted will come after you, but they're in three separated linked groups, and if you run away, they can be pulled apart. Running away in some other rooms likewise often sheds some but not all of the mobs, so you can then kill the ones that chase you. Quizzical 20:01, 11 March 2008 (UTC) :::::Pain Inverter works wonders on the Temple Gaurdians. Pulling is definitely the key, and at the end, taking a bit of time to get rid of the patrolling rangers before pulling stuff from the center (i.e., I am agreeing with above comments). The second key is to spread your team out and (if you have an MM) plant your MM at the back to keep the minions more in check (so they don't over aggro). The rits are definite pains! I had almost 3 minutes to spare using only heroes and henchies (3 necro build, me a splinter/barrager, Cynn, Eve blood ritual, mainly, Kai Ying and Sister Tai); only a few deaths, but nothing got worrisome. The method described in the article for the second room does work--avoided right hand mob entirely, except pulled the nearby ranger. GW-Susan 13:50, 8 November 2008 (UTC) Beat Record My record is 14:11 with MM (me), 3x Savannah Heat Heroes, Devona, Talon Silverwing, Sister Tai, Jamei. Possible to make it in ~13:00 if you'll hurry and won't pick up items. :Pics or didn't happen. And serious, who cares, Splinter Barrage rangers can nuke better. --Alf's Hitman 21:29, 21 August 2008 (UTC) random hints I put some of this into the main article, but it might get reverted, and also I felt some additional explanation might be useful, so... *Temple Guardians and Afflicted Elementalists mostly use Fire Magic, and the Afflicted Rangers use Kindle Arrows. Most of the wanding by other Afflicted is fire damage, too, although that might be coincidence. Therefore, Ward Against Harm lets the party tank massive groups of monsters, reducing the need for pulling to almost nothing. It also conveniently affects Mhenlo and Togo, too. Mantra of Flame also works well, although of course that only helps one person. Greater Conflagration would probably be overkill. (I personally swear by taking a water elementalist to this mission now - been through here at least ten times on all sorts of professions, and it just helps so much. Maelstrom is handy as usual, to mass-interrupt Flesh of my Flesh etc.) *Afflicted Monks have Aegis. But even if you take unblockable attacks/enchant removal, Afflicted Rangers make heavy use of Throw Dirt and will chase melee excessively to use it. If you are going to take a melee hero/hench, just be aware that they will be almost useless unless you constantly purge them of conditions; therefore, it might just be better to make them a pure tank for pulling, or even take no melee at all. (If you're taking Ward Against Harm, that's another good reason to take no melee.) Melee H/H also tend to grab extra aggro in rooms where not all mobs are linked, which can add extra difficulty to fights... *In Bound Naku's room, the best place to defend is just between the left and center groups, not quite on either of the bridges. Naku can be dealt with with ranged attacks, and the Temple Guardians will advance to melee range to use Bed of Coals. This avoids unnecessary aggro with the right fork of enemies. If you have melee, have them deal with the enemies on the left. *Snaring Teinai with something like Deep Freeze and not having any melee run up to attack her makes her very manageable. (Notice again how useful Water Magic is here.) *Personally, I find MMs to be rather useless here - Temple Guardians, RoJ, etc. makes very very short work of them and so you'll mostly have them in between fights where they do you no good. They can also screw up aggro very badly, which is suicidal in certain rooms, especially the end fight. If I'm going to take a Death-based Necro, I find that I get a lot more mileage out of Well of Suffering and Putrid Explosion, due to the tightly packed mobs. Mhenlo/H/H also tend to lag behind along with the MM to heal minions; while this won't cost the Master's reward, it is unnecessary extra time, and it can lead to engaging the right fork of mobs in Bound Naku's room if you are too slow to move out. (If it's Mhenlo whom this occurs with, you might possibly wipe, as he'll decide to stand his ground and fight the Afflicted...) *At Vizu... clear out one bridge. There should be two Afflicted Rangers who are approaching the party from either side; take them out so you're not caught unexpectedly by BHA to the healer. If you're the only human in the party, stand back a bit and flag the H/H forward past the bridge; as soon as they've drawn the aggro of some enemies, flag them back to your position. You can usually pull a number of Warriors this way, Vizu, possibly some Monks and Rangers, and also get some Monks to waste their RoJ. After dispatching this group, you can all rush the center and mop up the rest of the foes; they should mostly be casters, so AoE etc. cleans up nicely. *Walkthrough says that the patrolling rangers in the last room move to the center when you do. I'm not sure if I am not moving far enough into the center or what, but when I've been playing trough lately they seem content to just keep patrolling the perimeter. I'd have to say that out of all Canthan missions, I have the most difficulty consistently getting Master's here. Even so, it's not an especially hard mission. But I thought I might leave some helpful advice anyway. May as well do something productive from playing through Factions so much... >.< (T/ ) 10:18, 3 March 2009 (UTC) :1. For an elementalist, water is pretty much the way to go when fighting afflicted throughout factions, with few exceptions. :2. That and the tendency of melee AI characters to run off and grab extra mobs are the reasons why the hard mode section advises against taking melee at all if you can help it. At the very least, only players should be melee, and not henchmen, heroes, pets, or minions. :3. I usually flagged my group at the top of the stairs and pulled a couple of groups of mobs to there before advancing further. :4. I never tried that, but it sounds like it could work pretty well. :5. If melee is bad, minions are usually worse. I think a lot of people like minion masters everywhere because they never learn to do anything but sabway. :6. Pulling mobs out of the center is definitely the way to go against Vizu. I'd clear all of the rangers, though, pulling rangers instead of from the center of rangers are near, as it's easier to fight them separately rather than as adds. :I always thought that The Eternal Grove was a lot harder to get master's reward on than this one. The timer is fairly tight, both in easy mode with henchmen and in hard mode with heroes. Quizzical 17:14, 3 March 2009 (UTC) ::1. Water is useful here and in Gyala Hatchery specifically because of Ward Against Harm; an Earth elementalist also works well for both places, though for slightly different reasons (Eruption for starters). Anywhere else though, I found it more efficient to take a typical nuker with Savannah Heat; it makes very short work of the Afflicted backlines (Ritualists in particular), and I also find that taking stronger offensive party is better for other places. It does depend on the rest of the team's setup, of course. Water is good for Ward, Maelstrom, snares, and Blurred Vision; however if you can take care of the martial afflicted in other ways, a lot of those points are null, and Maelstrom works just as well with zero Water Magic. ::3. One thing I've been having trouble with is pulling things without Mhenlo/Togo/Danika etc. following me and thus becoming the tank. That works alright in hard mode where they are pretty durable, but tends to put them in great danger in easymode unless I pre-prot them with Shield of Deflection or something. Even if I take a flatbow and run away immediately after the shot... thusly, I've just found it a lot easier to turtle in the ward and laugh as Bed of Coals x50 becomes ~100 damage or so. Even in Kaolai's room where all the Afflicted bunch up at the bottom of the stairs - if you put up the Ward before engaging them, you can fight them all at once and have no deaths. (A well-placed Maelstrom helps, of course.) ::6. There are, I think, 8 rangers total which patrol, two at each bridge. Usually I end up taking out four to six of them before I am done. Two to clear a bridge, two more which have patrolled to my position by that point, and possibly another two after I do the first pull, depending on how fast I can kill. I find that if I run around the perimeter to take out the Rangers, that usually gets close to or costs me Master's, as it's hard to avoid also engaging the other Temple Guardians along the way. At most I'm looking at two to four Ranger adds, which isn't all that bad considering how the rest of the mob is still huge anyway. (Pre-casting Aegis helps a lot, too.) ::The Eternal Grove is definitely a more challenging mission in general, but because there is no time limit there, as long as I am careful and take proper precautions I am good to go. The only times I've been forced to restart that mission is when something catastrophic and unexpected happened, such as the hench getting spiked down when they should have lived (I blame Afflicted Monks), me accidentally unflagging key H/H (because I double-clicked to "unflag all"), etc etc. I have it worked out that as long as my character can deal enough damage to take out turtles efficiently, the rest of the team remains the same, and so it works regardless. (Exception will be playing as necro, where I'll probably take one of the MM roles.) (T/ ) 18:31, 3 March 2009 (UTC) Bound Vizu I have recently gotten to this level, although I haven't beaten it. I"ve been wondering though, since the mission says to stop the SPirit Binder from consuming Vizu, do you still use if it does, even though you still fight Bound Vizu at the end? V. Fire Daniels 20:14, 24 March 2009 (UTC) Restoration 1x or 2x? Kaoli uses Restoration, so one could (in theory) spend all day in his room killing and re-killing. However, after killing him the first time, the spirits-released counter increments by 1, the mission notes update, and the Kaoli's unbound spirit opens the door to the next room. Is it necessary to kill him until he stays dead? Which ever way it is, I think we should add an explicit note. —''Tennessee Ernie Ford'' (TEF) 01:18, September 8, 2010 (UTC) :He only needs to die once, and then Togo and Mhenlo have to be dragged to the allied Koala. Imo, it's fairly self evident. I don't think there are any places were one would have to re-kill an enemy to progress once the questlog/etc. said it's done. Also, a non-killing example: You can complete the bonus on Gate of Madness without currently controlling all the shrines; I once lost Shiro on Balth's shrine for some reason. He recaptured the shrine whilst I was capping the other shrines (didn't even realise he was gone until the last shrine was capped). Bonus counted as complete even without reconverting Balthazar's place. --Vipermagi 14:57, September 8, 2010 (UTC) :It's just like with bounties and vanquishing - creature deaths only count the first time, you don't get additional bounty points or vanquish counts for killing resurrected creatures. :In this case, it's probably more practical to "kill him until he stays dead," though, since if you don't, Dumb and Dumber will just stand around fighting him instead of moving on to the next room. —Dr Ishmael 15:25, September 8, 2010 (UTC) :: It's fairly self-evident. Alas, would that were so. The reason I am asking is that I was helping a friend achieve masters/HM. Special K died, once, twice, and only one of us exited staged left. The released spirit opened the door and I dragged Mhenlo/Togo away (luck and the AI being on the side of Angels for a change). However, I was not so fortunate with my friend, who could not leave the room. :: I quickly checked both wikis after flagging my heroes back to assist, as only that would convince my buddy. Neither wiki has an explicit note about this unusual situation which arises on when an in-between boss can be rez'd. Not everyone who aims to complete missions is aware of the 1x rule for bounties and VQs (b/c not everyone cares about the associated titles). And thus, we spent an extra precious 45s or so in K's room, especially annoying since the various released spirits kept getting hung up on chests and allies minions/spirits. :: Incidentally, Fendi Nin seems to require multiple deaths and o/c Varesh must be killed twice in Ruins of Morah. :: So, while I agree that there aren't any areas which require re-killing when a boss is rez'd, perhaps this one could use a note, such as: :::Kaoli and his party can easily come back to life, since he casts Restoration; even Frozen Soil cannot prevent this. However, you can safely leave after his spirit is released provided (a) his spirit opens the gate to the next room and (b) Mhenlo and Togo follow the party (and do not stay to fight). :: —''Tennessee Ernie Ford'' (TEF) 16:04, September 8, 2010 (UTC) :::Hence, 'imo'. Sidenote: T&M follow whoever's walking, and prioritise the party leader. They don't mind running away all that much, but it does take walking a little more than aggro range away, which is somewhat discomforting since it means they are overextended. But it works. :::The Fendi Nin you need to kill is actually Soul of Fendi Nin, which dies only once, and the Varesh fight is actually two separate monsters. Neither of the bosses technically resurrect, and the quest log never says you need to move on before it's truly over. The closest thing would be the Lich fight; he does "stand up" repeatedly. Then again, he never really dies; he regains health before he does so akin to Divine Intervention. --Vipermagi 16:56, September 8, 2010 (UTC)